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Author Topic: optimizing your 3d model  (Read 3941 times)

« Reply #15 on: October 19, 2010, 01:44:52 PM »
getting weirder  :P (see attached img.)
now THAT I dont have idea why.

aaaanyway... that aside,
tried to export using your settings, psikoT, but got the same result as before, meaning I get good frame rate only if merge everything.

when you say you have the same results as AllanF, you mean there's no difference in framerate no matterif you merge or just select all together OR group and just export without merging?
just double-checking, because AllanF also said, lately, that he experience the strange thing I do opening my examples (.x files) with mview.

the difference in file size is not due at exporting as binary compressed but it was the setting Optimize Mesh > Normal in the tab Mesh. althought no matter what I set there, it dosnt change the result we are talking about here.
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Mic

« Reply #16 on: October 19, 2010, 02:08:21 PM »
Quote
merge or just select all together OR group

One thing to note, for each object in max that you have, it would make a new draw call in the engine. In Mview, it has an hierarchy view that you can look at. It will show all the meshes. I once used that a lot for draw order in 3impact for my race track environments. Using linking to arrange the draw order of the mesh.

Best thing to export out of max is a simple object that is set to editable mesh, with a collapsed stack.
« Reply #17 on: October 19, 2010, 02:31:02 PM »
One thing to note, for each object in max that you have, it would make a new draw call in the engine.  [...]  I once used that a lot for draw order in 3impact for my race track environments.

now that you say that, it have all the sense in the world!!

if I model transparent things and create them in certain order in 3dsmax, save the whole thing as an single .x file and use it in a single skinmesh object in 3drad, that allow me to trick the infamous trasparency problem (props to shadmar's vegetation shader!).

however  :P I've just tested this: some transparent models in 3dsmax, merged them all in the same mesh and save it. I tested 2: one all merged in a single mesh, and another all the separete objects. as before, in mview the one that I merged all in the same mesh have a more than 10X better framerate.

this time I looked for that hierarchy you mention, the merged one dont have much hierarchy at all, just one object. the one I exported all the separete objects have a hierarchy showing all the objects.

so far, that seems perfectly normal.

what really caught my attention is that I thought that the draw order enginered through modeling order to trick the infamous trasparency would be affected merging everything in a single object, my bet was I would be able to see the first object only. surprise is the draworder remains intact, with the same object.

so, according to mview hierarchy I have just one object, but 3drad draw everything in the intended order... so, how many drawcalls are being made despite the amount of objects?

------------
what a mess I just wrote!  8)
« Last Edit: October 19, 2010, 02:33:45 PM by loop »
Crashing Boxes - winner of the 3d games category at the 5th Uruguayan video game contest
get a copy for your iPad/iPhone!

Mic

« Reply #18 on: October 19, 2010, 03:22:57 PM »
so, according to mview hierarchy I have just one object, but 3drad draw everything in the intended order... so, how many drawcalls are being made despite the amount of objects?

I've noticed that 3drad handles draw order good, not great, but good. So having everything in one mesh is a great way to make it run faster. If your only using 1 texture, and you made it all one mesh, you just have 1 draw call.
« Reply #19 on: October 19, 2010, 05:43:08 PM »
This is a great discussion to have in mind regarding map building.   Logically,  3drad lends itself to the idea of being a powerful level editing tool.  But taking into these considerations (not to mention the object limit)  one would think you could get better results by exporting your map as a single model mesh into 3drad. 

Or am i not understanding this correctly?
« Reply #20 on: October 20, 2010, 01:34:25 AM »
The best case scenario for 3D Rad rendering (and probably any other 3d engine) is one single draw call, as Mic suggested.

So for example one large scene made of one single model with just one single big texture will always render faster than any other configuration.

Even when the 3d model is one single piece in your 3d modeler, it may get exported as different geometries. This is always the case when you are using multiple texture files for the model because for each texture one individual 'frame' (piece of geometry) is created in the .x file by the exporter.

« Reply #21 on: October 20, 2010, 04:18:39 AM »
So if you use a single model with different textures: what is the most optimised way to use it in 3drad? Is it by splitting up the model by texture and use different skinmeshes for each one of them, or to export it just like a single model?
What is the maximum number of textures per model?
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psikotropico

« Reply #22 on: October 20, 2010, 06:04:34 AM »
So if you use a single model with different textures: what is the most optimised way to use it in 3drad? Is it by splitting up the model by texture and use different skinmeshes for each one of them, or to export it just like a single model?
What is the maximum number of textures per model?

the best workflow imho is using MultiSubObject materials (in 3dsMax), where all textures have an unique ID that you can apply to each polygon of the model, individually or by groups (elements)... by this way, you can apply all different textures you want to one single model... you will only need use separate skinmeshes for those that have transparency...

hope it helps


« Reply #23 on: October 20, 2010, 07:08:35 AM »
So if you use a single model with different textures: what is the most optimised way to use it in 3drad? Is it by splitting up the model by texture and use different skinmeshes for each one of them, or to export it just like a single model?
What is the maximum number of textures per model?

There is no maximum for the number of textures you can use in a .x file, but there is a limit in the max textures that can be allocated by 3D Rad (adjustable by modifying the arrays.ini file in the main 3D Rad folder).

When using multiple textures for a single SkinMesh, it all depends on how exactly the .x file exporter you use arranges the different geometries in the .x file.

Usually there will only be one single piece of geometry for each texture, but in some cases (sometimes depending on how exactly you have designed the object in the modeler) a group of polygons that share the same texture may be split into different 'geometry pieces', causing unnecessary overhead.
« Reply #24 on: November 19, 2010, 02:14:50 PM »
Excuse me for a bit dumb question, but how can you merge objects in Google Sketchup?
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